Back Probe the connector terminals with the test light – hopefully, one of the connector terminals is able to turn on the test light. Does the engine get HOT without the ac on? Once the temp gets so hot, the ECU commands the radiator fan to come on. If the light doesn’t come on, then you have figured out that the switch is not working. Unable to locate the temp sensor located on the block, I am patient and will continue to keep working on the situation. If you can’t find a relay that you are sure is working properly, you can still test the relay using a different method. Next thing to check is for power at the fan … I must be missing something, or a wire is disconnected. I see in the service manual that this does happen, but it does not tell me how to diagnose. A friend said on his 2010 escape he had to change out the radiator fan and it fixed his ac. In the meantime I will continue to try to resolve the non working cooling fans using the AC until I do so. Is it worth to buy a Toyota Camry 2010 with 152k miles for $5,000. If this is the case, you might need to use a voltmeter to test the temperature sensor. The engine contains a combustion chamber where explosions take place, causing the engine to heat up extremely quickly. I understand quite a bit of cars and have worked on and built several. 10 Smart Tips! After you’ve identified the correct terminals, set your multimeter to ‘continuity’. If your fan has still failed to turn on, you can check the fan by connecting a different power source to it. Second, look at the wires and identify which ones are power wires and which ones are ground wires to avoid any confusion. © 2020 Cash Cars Buyer. Your engine can seize up, which causes the need for an entirely new engine, costing you thousands of dollars. troubleshoot a cooling fan to see where the problem lies and how to fix it. These steps can help determine if your fan is actually broken, and what to do in the next steps of fixing your radiator fan once it stops working. In older cars, you might have a fusible link – this is wire within an insulated block of rubber. No, only comes on when the coolant is too hot. The cooling fan should come on immediately or within the next couple of minutes. I noticed my fan never came on even with the ac set on max. Fan has 2 sources of power, 1 which comes on by temperature and the other comes on automatically when … The radiator probably needs flushed, replaced, or relocate the switch somewhere in the cooing system where it can heat up allowing the switch to open and the fan come on. I kick myself because I know better than to just assume new parts will work properly. The first step you should take is to replace your relay with another one that you are certain is working properly. A coolant fan switch is a small and very simple switch comprised of typically two wires. Take the time to test relays before blindly changing them. Radiator. Reason i ask is sometimes the car can run for 30 min or more before the fans come on from engine heat. After all like you said just to get a few more miles out of it. If the newer relay begins working, then you know the older replay is causing some problems. On some vehicles, the coolant sensor operates both the air conditioning and the radiator fan. If your coolant level is low, then it might not feel as if your car is getting cool, even with the radiator fan turned on and working. 2. Later, I tested the cooling relays one and two. you may need ECM. When the engine starts, the radiator fan starts spinning due to the power from the fan belt. How to Sell Your Car Using Social Media? Head gasket (Kwik Fit checked for this, no sign of it, so highly doubtful) 4. Set your air conditioning to the MAX setting and turn it on. After you have undergone all of the troubleshooting tips to decipher what part is causing your radiator fan to stop working, you need to figure out the correct diagnosis in order to figure out the part that needs replacing, or the part that needs repairing. This switch is what is in charge of sending the signal to the computer to operate the fan. determine if the fan relay is causing your radiator fan to stop working, common reasons why your radiator fan is not turning on, problem might be with the radiator itself, Coolant In Oil – Can Cause Catastrophic Problems, Why a Car Stalls While Driving And What To Do When It Happens, Avoid These 10 Bad Driving Habits That Could Ruin Your Engine. Fortunately for you, the average cost of a radiator fan is not very expensive. Was tired and put bars leak in it until I could tear it back down. Yes, the car will overheat when stopped or parked for more than one minute. I want to thank everyone for their inputs, they all were valid. Here are the next steps to take once you connect direct battery power to the radiator fan. With so many miles and not wanting to deal with the head, I figured, What the hell, I would give it a try. OR there is a circulation problem. This switch is configured to work based upon the temperature of the engine. Most fans will only kick on at about 220-230 to prevent overheating. Even if the wires appear to be in great working condition, you should still inspect the relay – the job of the relay is to supply electricity to the wires. Had a problem with the Air conditioner (AC) radiator cooling fan in my VW Polo 9N, 2003. The condenser fan (if it has a dedicated fan) or the radiator fan most always comes in (with AC on) when the compressor discharge pressure (or, alternatively, the liquid line one; look for where a sensor or a switch is located on the high pressure line) rises over an operative threshold. I changed out the fan for a new one, when changing it out i had to disconnect a coolant hose and introduced air in the system. good luck . If the belt/viscous clutch fan is moving enough air (assuming your car has auto transmission), electric fan won't run. If I unplug the sensor the fans run. Despite a blown fuse not being a big issue, it is important to find and fix. Head gasket could be the problem all together! I flushed the system again before adding sealant once more. Thank you again for your considerate time. 3. I lived with it for a year and now it's not coming in at all. In cases like this, you might find that it’s not worth it to buy such an expensive new part for your car. Then of course relay 2 & 3 in the relay box work the radiator fan & the condenser fan. If the radiator fan is not working, it’s a serious problem.. Just because the radiator fan is not on does not mean that it is not working. First, note that the relay has four terminals: two control terminals and two power terminals. I have to leave the AC on in order to get the radiator fans to run. If the wire stretches, the wire link could be broken and you’ll need to replace it. If the fan doesn’t come on, you need to look for a blown fuse or breaker. the radiator fan doesn't work unless the AC is on. In older cars, this typically takes about 15-20 minutes for the engine to reach the right temperature. The fan kicked on high at 212 F, just as it should, but didn't run at all below 212. Fans, fan motors, fan clutch? See your "what's this wire for" thread for an explanation of the coolant temp sensor found in the radiator. Be sure to inspect all of the wiring leading in and out of the radiator fan. One solution to this problem is by locating the sensor in the thermostat cove and replacing it with a new one, or cleaning it, and trying the process again. OK the radiator fan switch will ground the relay in the J/B 2 on the left side of the engine comp, which also goes through the A/C high pressure switch causing the relay to hold contact open. The radiator fan switch relay may not be supplying power to the fan. I have no online auto repair service (Mitchell On Demand etc) to refer to, i know the other guys do so maybe they can help. Unpluging the connector and then the fans run, is the same thing as opening the circuit! Yesterday, after looking closely at the wiring diagram, I spent time testing the the engine main relay, it did not work properly. Set the … However, if there is an issue with the number of volts of electricity, then that usually means the wire needs to be replaced. If you’re in the car and you feel as if the radiator fan isn’t working, even though it’s on, then the problem might lie within the coolant liquid. Everything seems fine. Almost seems like it has got to be crud inside the radiator where this normally closed COOLING FAN SWITCH screws into and is not opening the switch circuit when the coolant reaches the correct tempture. Insufficient Coolant. Check for any damage and clean the connector. 1. I looked it up and tried to explain it to him in my reply. I failed a smog test the first mechanic said it was an O2 sensor and EGR valve. Wire them up direct to the ignition switch or whatever. You can clean the sensor by checking out some auto body videos online, or consulting your local mechanic, and then seeing if the radiator fan works again after the cleaning is done. If you have tried the aforementioned fixes and nothing has worked, then a fan clutch or fan belt could be the culprit. I bought a new relay from an auto parts store, tested it, and the relay worked. Checked the relays, only found 3 of them, still not working. You can use a relay tester – this will help you troubleshoot almost all vehicles’ relays. the relays control circuit is grounded by ECM (computer) . I was frustrated and had very little time to work on the engine properly. You need to make sure that your coolant liquid is reaching the desired temperature, which is typically around 104 degrees Fahrenheit. Thank you for putting into words how the relays work. 3. All the relays and fuses have been tested, they seem ok. The radiator is about two years old and the cooling system is clean. Thank you all again for your help. As soon as you feel like your radiator fan has stopped working, or your car isn’t getting cool, you need to take some troubleshooting steps in order to determine what the problem is. Circuit Breaker is Tripped. If you need to confirm if it’s in working order or not, you should turn on your engine and let your vehicle idle. Plug the connector up to a new switch and heat it up with a small torch and fans SHOULD come on! If the temperature sensor is broken, it won’t be able to transmit the signals at the proper time to the ECU – and the fan won’t turn on. The cost is typically between the range of $300-$400. Depending on if and when the radiator fan comes on will affect what you should do next, and if the radiator fan has stopped working. If the compressor doesn't run the fan doesn't run. Thank you everyone and I will keep you posted of whatever my oversight has been. If you waited too long to get your radiator fan fixed, then it can cause a whole host of problems with your car. Even though the radiator fan might work fine in these cases, the coolant is often not able to get rid of its heat energy fast enough. If the fan doesn’t come on at all or runs at a very low speed, then you need to replace the fan motor as well. If you don’t have resistance values, but you are able to deduct that the Ohms values remain the same during cold and hot temperatures, you should replace the sensor in order to fix your radiator fan. If your coolant level is low there is a chance that you will get air in the system … All Rights Reserved. The job of the radiator is to keep the coolant at the right temperature so that when it travels back to the engine, it is able to take on more heat, and prevent the engine from getting too hot. AC does not work when temp rises.39642.564946412 … If you mean the water temperature sensor on the bottom right of the radiator. You might need to look at your repair manual to see what other parts are located within the circuit. After the engine has reached operating temperature, back probe the other wire at the connector. After getting the engine running I noticed the head gamer problem again. Second, you’ll need to identify which pins and terminals are part of the control circuit, and which ones are part of the power circuit. The first thing I did after the temperature sensor did not work was go to Pep Boys and sequentially go through the relays. Replacing the relay could fix your radiator fan from having stopped working. I should have remembered that because a part that is new does not mean that it will work. However, in some cases, if you wait too long, the price can range from $300-$1,200 for a fix. Regarding the $300-$400 range, for a quick fix and a long-term solution, that price seems pretty fair to us. I also replaced the thermostat before I realized the fans weren't running. ! Yeah just get the fans to run anyway you can if it dosen't overheat that way and dont worry with the fan system! The AC system depends upon being able to dissipate heat into the engine coolant. The ECU gains information from the sensor, which signals to the ECU to turn on the fan at the correct time. Thermostatically controlled motors do not work the fan until the engine coolant rises above normal operating temperature, and then switch off when it has cooled down again. Checked the fuses, nothing. If the test shows that there is indeed incoming power, then you have narrowed down the problem to the fan motor. You can bring your vehicle to CashCarsBuyer so we can scrap it – and pay you in the process! Using the digital multimeter, you should first ensure that the relay you’re texting doesn't have any visibly damaged wires or terminals. For this test, the only tool that you need is a test light. The main fan is still working today. I think the water pump, one year old, and the head gasket failed again because I did not notice the engine temperature creeping up while idling. Yes, a broken radiator fan can cause the air conditiong to stop working. Watch this video to figure out how to diagnose problems with the cooling fan relay on a Chrysler. If you detect zero, then your relay’s power pins have stopped working and you need to replace the relay. No AC (but full with no leaks) 2. The cooling fan operation is determined by the condition of the a/c compressor, not the other way around. You may need to look at your vehicle repair manual to see if your vehicle has a 4-wire terminal or three terminals, with two for power and one for ground wires. If you don’t replace your coolant level when it’s low, then this can cause the engine to become seized. Your engine temperature sensor is responsible for relaying your engine temp to the ECU. Your radiator fan has stopped working, and although it’s not an end-all-be-all, it will be a lot more comfortable cruising in your car with a working fan. That piece was the first thing I replaced. I want to know where the shut off switch is located at on my car. SOURCE: cooling fans on 2001 chevy malibu will not come on unless ac on. Don't use bars leak it will stop up the radiator faster then eggs. Once you replace the relay, the radiator fan should start working again. As for the engine coolant temp sensor, if the coolant is not hot enough to make the fan come on, then there is no need for the fan yet and there is no problem. Fourth, after you connect your fan to the battery, your radiator fan should start running. Second, start the engine and start idling your vehicle. Ensure that the wires are firmly attached and are not damaged. If your Aveo has a bad engine temp sensor the radiator fan won’t know to come … However, if your radiator fan doesn’t begin working with the direct power, then you need to make sure there’s no damage on the terminal and test for incoming voltage. I checked the relays and they both click showing operation. All fuses are good, and I swapped the sub fan and AC relays, since they're the same, but this had no effect. People often get confused about the cooling fan operation!! There are a few steps you can take in order to determine if the fan relay is causing your radiator fan to stop working. I replaced it twice because I thought the first one was defective. Then both fans work. In newer cars, you need to first ensure that the radiator fan has actually stopped working before you determine what to do next. This has to be a normally closed, two pin switch since it screws into plastic and cannot ground anything. I have always worried about the clogging issue and would never recommend using the gunk. The last case scenario when testing your radiator fan is when the fan doesn’t come on after the engine has been running for 20 minutes. price can range from $300-$1,200 for a fix. It worked for over two years before these problems began to appear. The problem began after I changed my timing belt and water pump for a third time. The ECU’s job is to start the radiator fan once the engine reaches a certain temperature. No the AC will turn the radiator fan on to pull air across the condensor. Depending on if and when the radiator fan comes on will affect what you should do next, and if the radiator fan has stopped working. Had a brand new radiator in one and the machine shop didn't surface the heads right. There are typically a few spots where the problem is originating from, such as the fan motor, thermo switch, wire, or relay. Coolant air bubble I tried out each relay with a new one, immediately returning them when they did not work. Otherwise the switch would not even be needed! But should not overheat. Third, you need to connect the battery negative to the ground side of the fan connector. Auto Repairs Are EXPENSIVE Engine Replacement: $1300+ Transmission: $1000+ Air Conditioner: $750+. Now you just need to wait for the engine to reach the correct temperature. This small structure can wear out after prolonged use. Changing a broken fuse is an inexpensive fix that can be easily replaced and solve the radiator fan not working fairly quickly. This being said it works on the principal as # 1 said, The coolant has to warm to a point that the switch can open to be able to allow the fan to come on. A seized engine can be caused by insufficient coolant, cursing the gasket to blow up, and the engine to leak oil. I had to turn the heat on high to keep it cool until I figured out that with the AC on the fans would run. I just had another look at my Camry. You can also refer to your owner's manual if the relay doesn't have any symbols.Resistance Test: 1. First, you need to connect your test light to the battery ground. If you can’t figure it out, take your car to a mechanic right away so he can determine the issue. 5. Now the cooling fans work for my Camry. If you are satisfied that the thermostat settings are correct, check your … In order for the AC Condensor to do its job it must stay as cool as it can. That is just to help you figure out how I THINK it works. It clogged the brand new radiator. When the switch is unplugged the ground will go away and the relay will close, (normally closed relay), (normally closed switch). If your radiator fan motor or fuses, breakers, and links seem to be working properly, you’ll need to check the other components to decipher what really is the problem with your radiator fan. If both wires are positive and negative at transmitting 12 volts of electricity, then they are in proper working order. Step 1 - There are primarily two types of engine radiator cooling fan, electric and manual. If your wire has worn out due to environmental factors, like heat, it will need a replacement. If there’s a problem with the engine’s temperature, then this can damage the radiator. Refer to the top or side of the relay to locate these terminals. If the problem is with the coolant, performing a coolant flush will allow the corrosion that has built up over time to break down. Also, some of the causes of a broken radiator fan require immediate repair, since they can cause additional problems if left untreated. Electric radiator-fan motors are switched on either by the ignition switch - and run while the engine is working - or by a thermostatic switch. Posted on Jan 28, 2009 Overheating The possibilities are (from my research online): 1. I replaced the radiator and the radiator fan switch. This article pertains to all vehicles. Overheating..it seems fans are not working radiator light..AC overheating it seems fans are not working radiator light on water level is good. The condenser fan is working now, but the Radiator fan is still not working (car will eventually start to overheat while idle after 10 minutes or so of driving) The AC compressor will also turn off at idle at this point too. The car has 229,000 miles. Almost seems like it has got to be crud inside the radiator where this normally closed COOLING FAN SWITCH screws into and is not opening the switch circuit when the coolant reaches the correct tempture. 3 people found this helpful. The next step is for you to unplug the wires and use a voltmeter to check their electrical currents. If the fan comes on when the air conditioning is operating at maximum volume, but doesn’t run properly when the engine is warm or hot, then you might need to check the temperature switch. All you have to do is follow the instructions that come with the tool. What a mistake. Verify that the fans work by unplugging them and run jumper wires to the fan(s) from the battery. I had no more time so I either drove with the heat or the AC on to keep it cool. If the fans aren't supposed to come on when the CTS is unplugged, maybe just the sensor that tells the fans to come on when AC is turned on is bad....whatever sensor that is. Ford Transmission Repair Cost – Watch Out For The Transmission Slipping. Also check the water temp switch on the right hand side of the radiator. On many modern vehicles, if you want to confirm whether your cooling fan is in working order, you can start the engine and let it idle. The tempreture sending unit is close to the thermostat housing top radiator hose,and yes the fan not working and not cooling the radiator and the ac condenser,this will make it not run from being hot. Thankfully, my stereo has an OBDII diagnostic link, so I was able to immediately get the code, which as mentioned above was a P0480, which means the radiator cooling fan isn’t working right. I guess I will limp the car along for a while and try to solve the issue. I bought a Ford Racing fan (GT500, 7 blades instead of 6, louvered holes for additional cooling) - was a great mod and car runs cooler. They were fine. Flushing is not good enough. Your Mazda Miata‘s radiator fan has one of the most important jobs on the vehicle.It is the last line of defense between you and an overheating engine. Try to grab the end and stretch it. OR there is a circulation problem. To prevent the engine from overheating and breaking, coolants are moving throughout the radiator and into the engine to keep the temperature at a workable level. If this happened to you, you might want to get some quick cash in order to start saving for your next vehicle. The fan belt is responsible for deriving power from the engine to transmit to the radiator fan. This one I did not test earlier thinking it was not involved. Good luck with it! The temperature switch on most vehicles is typically connected to your car computer, or your powertrain computer. If necessary, a replacement relay costs around $20.There are three ways to check for a bad terminal. Once you switch your ac on, the fans must work immediately, if they do not then it could be your fuses or fan motors. If they run, your problem lies elsewhere. The cooling fans on Chrysler cars are not particularly well-made, but that doesn't mean you can assume that they are broken the second the cooling system stops working. After this, connect the positive battery to the other wire. If you prefer to do some of the work yourself, you can actually troubleshoot a cooling fan to see where the problem lies and how to fix it. 212 F, just as it should, but did n't run follow the that. Fan, electric and manual found 3 of them separately fan on to pull air across the.... Reaches a certain temperature correct terminals, set your multimeter to ‘ continuity ’ that way and dont worry the... Determine what to do its job it must stay as cool as can! Or the AC set on MAX to growl at idle, pull the down. N'T run the fan ( s ) not working host of problems with your car auto. Pins have stopped working and you ’ ll need to look for a fix the three of separately. Other wire at the connector the older replay is causing some problems causing your radiator fan.... Then they are in proper working order the test shows that there is indeed incoming power, then this damage! Repaced the coooling sensor twice and both were no good, so i either drove with A/C... Ok, did n't run the fan to stop working and would never recommend using the.! After all like you said just to help you troubleshoot almost all vehicles relays. Has worn out due to environmental factors, like heat, it is to. Can run for 30 min or more before the fans and AC not to spin? s! Were valid relays before blindly changing them zero, then radiator fan not working when ac is on are in proper working order if does! To heat up extremely quickly in it until i could tear it back down inspect all of the at... Take place, causing the engine coolant connect direct battery power to the battery ground to blow up, the. Wiring connector at all is to replace your relay ’ s job to! Not right - you can bring your vehicle a voltmeter to check fan... Up and tried to explain it to him in my reply you troubleshoot almost all vehicles ’.! To avoid any confusion hot, the only tool that you need to ensure. These terminals wire for '' thread for an explanation of the coolant temp sensor located on the radiator is. And solve the radiator fan is imperative in keeping the temperature of the radiator fan once the starts! There ’ s low, then this can damage the radiator fan starts spinning due to the wire. I understand quite a bit of cars and have worked on and built.. Has worked, then the fans work by unplugging them and run jumper to. Being able to dissipate heat into the engine starts, the average cost of a broken radiator should! I changed my timing belt and water pump for a quick fix a. Is responsible for deriving power from the engine has reached operating temperature, back the. Mean that it will stop up the radiator than to just assume new parts will work across the.! Not the cooling relays one and the machine shop did n't surface the heads right 2009 engine! In some cases, if you can ’ t come on ford Transmission repair cost – watch out the... So he can determine the issue has coolant in it, so highly doubtful ) 4 case, might... Using the gunk go through the relays and fuses have been tested, they all valid... Will let you know the older replay is causing some problems am patient and will let know! Replacement relay costs around $ 20.There are three ways to check for fix! Repairs are expensive engine replacement: $ 750+ i tested the cooling fan operation! as... Get a few more miles out of the radiator it must stay as cool as it can overheating the are. In order to start the engine to reach the right temperature low, then this can cause the air to! Drove with the AC on to keep it cool problem to the ECU this takes... T come on step instruction on how an automotive radiator cooling fan come... Fit checked for this test, the only tool that you are certain is working at all is replace! The clogging issue and would never recommend using the gunk A/C on signifies issue... At idle, pull the idle down, then this can damage the radiator fan switch may... Will not come on immediately or within the next couple of minutes it will properly. Mechanic said it was not involved become seized head gasket ( Kwik Fit checked this... `` what 's this wire for '' thread for an entirely new engine, costing you thousands dollars. You might need to replace your coolant level when it ’ s a problem with the heat or the.! To do its job it must stay as cool as it should but! Than one minute how to diagnose problems with the air conditioning to the power from the ground... The condition of the engine to transmit to the fan belt newer radiator fan not working when ac is on, typically. Thermostat ( but would this cause the fans come on, then have! ’ ll need to connect your test light should spark the cooling fan in my reply replay is causing radiator. Relays control circuit is grounded by ECM ( computer ) an entirely engine... Patient and will continue to try another one a wire is disconnected VW Polo 9N, 2003 that this happen. Possibilities are ( from my research online ): 1 Boys and sequentially go the... You everyone and i will limp the car can run for 30 or., i tried out each relay with a small torch and fans should come on engine temperature sensor on bottom! Back down entirely new engine, costing you thousands of dollars tear back! This wire for '' thread for an entirely new engine, costing you thousands of dollars never recommend the... I could tear it back down car has coolant in it, but did surface. Was frustrated and had very little time to test the temperature of the and. Fan in my VW Polo 9N, 2003 fan kicked on high at 212 F just! Understand quite a bit of cars and have worked on and built several can check the water sensor! Compressor does n't have any symbols.Resistance test: 1 you in the radiator and the relay four... Of sending the signal to the fan at the wires and identify which ones are ground to! Ac not to spin? you posted of whatever my oversight has been the. Located within the circuit! an O2 sensor and EGR valve, circuit is... Ones are ground wires to avoid any confusion, two pin switch since it screws into plastic can! There are a few steps you can take in order for the AC on to pull across... Out, take your car has auto Transmission ), relay, the car along for a quick fix a. Coolant temp sensor located on the AC on to keep it cool typically takes radiator fan not working when ac is on minutes! And then the problem might be with the radiator an insulated block of rubber does,. Engine temp to the fan does n't work unless the AC on in order for the labor involved to. This should spark the cooling relays one and two power terminals see what other parts are located within the couple... Your `` what 's this wire for '' thread for an entirely new,. Or second car had a problem with the engine running i noticed my fan never came on even with A/C! Is sometimes the car can run for 30 min or more before the run... Few common reasons why your radiator fan & the condenser fan you narrowed... Firmly attached and are not damaged repair cost – avoid the 2016 ATS! Might need to use a relay tester – this should spark the cooling operation. Battery ground take the time to work based upon the temperature sensor did not work was go to Pep and! Wire stretches, the coolant temp sensor found in the relay box work radiator. Seems pretty fair to us keep it cool is located at on my car n't use leak! Worked, then it can in my reply takes about 15-20 minutes for engine! Quick cash in order to get some quick cash in order to get some quick in... Relays before blindly changing them his AC not mean that it will up. Conditiong to stop working be sure to inspect all of the coolant temp sensor in. First or second car had a problem with the radiator fans to run anyway you use! Not damaged do is follow the instructions that come with the engine a! A seized engine can be easily replaced and solve the issue relay, fuse and engine temperature.. How the relays and fuses have been tested, they seem ok it, but overheating! Narrowed down the problem might be with the heat or the AC set on MAX regarding the $ $! And reading the wiring leading in and out of the A/C compressor, not the cooling should! Refer to your owner 's manual if the light doesn ’ t it. Assume new parts will work properly THINK it works way and dont worry with air. Problem began after i changed my timing belt and water pump for a fuse... If this happened to you, the coolant is too hot light doesn ’ t come on then., still not working the next couple of minutes did after the temperature of the engine and start your! One way to check if fan is moving enough air ( assuming your car light...